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Counterpoint
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I’ve posted this song before in another context, but the refrain does feature a fun vocal counterpoint that I’ve never heard in any other arrangement:
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Hi David, that is a clever use of counterpoint there in that one. David Bennett illustrated this one in his video, but here it is again. Masterful use of counterpoint. They are in perfect harmony, and then they go out of phase, and then sync up again, and do that over and over. Just magic!
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David, here is another one. It’s the highlight of the symphony for me. There is counterpoint throughout the piece, but from the 6 minutes mark to the end is spectacular. In parts it feels like two main voices rocking back and forth between each other in counterpoint. It almost feels like drums beating. “Listen to that counterpoint!!!”
https://youtu.be/rRgXUFnfKIY?t=362
The music graphically drawn out like this is kind of cool, and perhaps is a close representation of how Beethoven visualized his music as he became more deaf.
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This is beautiful. Two voices in harmony and in conversation.
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Okay Jung…lol…ya kinda lost me in this topic, about ” counterpoint” as I’m not all that Music Tech Smart, more precisely …. lol… not sure what you’re meaning by this ” counterpoint” reference/terminology, I have a basic idea of concept but you lost me….lol….
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Jacki, check out the video that Jung posted at the beginning of this thread. David Bennett is really good at explaining points (and counterpoints) of music theory and providing well-known examples to illustrate them.
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Lots of counterpoint here, to the extent that it’s hard to make out all the dialogue. It runs from the cued spot to about the seven-minute mark. (Spoiler alert: this is the climactic scene from Phantom of the Opera!)
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Hi Jacki! Thanks for checking this out. Your interest takes you half way there to understanding counterpoint already.
David Bennett in the video explains, “counterpoint is a musical texture, where each voice of the music, each part, moves with it’s own independent motion and contour, and yet between the different voices we still get a sense of harmony.”
If music is made up of many different voices, where an instrument is a voice, and a singer is also a voice, these voices can each have it’s own independent melody, but together still forms a sense of harmony.
In Mona and Lisa’s “She’s Leaving Home”, they both sing the same lyrics in harmony, but at certain instances the lyrics and voice line become independent and go their separate way, and then come together again, weaving in and out of harmony. But throughout, they form a unity despite having independent voices in parts. It just sounds very nice and captivating when they do this.
This is the appeal of counterpoint, the brain just likes it, and finds it fascinating and irresistible just like consonance and dissonance (happy and sad).
David, that Phantom of the Opera with the voices in conversation illustrates counterpoint well. In some sense, music is really a conversation between the singers and instrument, each with it’s own musical voice interacting, and it’s in that interaction we have harmony and counterpoint that together can sound so appealing.
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I’ve long been intrigued by the structure of this song. The two vocals are intertwined and play off of each other, but they don’t really harmonize. Is this counterpoint? I tend to think not.
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Hi David. Counterpoint in music theory seems to be a deeep topic with much complexity. When counterpoint is done effectively it’s very powerful and you know it. I am not sure here, it could be in some parts. I think this one would take a music professor with a PHD who specializes in counterpoint to make a determination.????
Here is another good explanation.
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“..counterpoint is everywhere.
The opening few bars of Stairway to Heaven is just two lines moving in contrary motion with two static voices harmonizing.” -
I came across an interesting article by John Schaefer:
“How To Be Smarter About Counterpoint”
I like how he describes counterpoint like a relationship.
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Another fine classical/baroque example of counterpoint. Listen to that counterpoint!!! Different choral melody lines weaving in and out with each other in perfect counterpoint harmony! Mesmerizing.
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Thanks for the additional video and article, Jung. It’s becoming clearer, and further examples keep leaping into my head:
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I’ve just got Broadway on the brain tonight:
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Hi everyone,
i am just catching up to this. There are some wonderful examples here of counterpoint in pop music. Shred has me convinced that parallel and similar are just plain harmony.
Her is my contribution. Buskin & Batteau have been around a long time.
All of the contrapoint is in the third verse. Six minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9UBMWthpHwhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9UBMWthpHw
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