Guest Howard
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Following are some comments from Quora relating mainly to whether John Lennon was underrated as a rhythm guitarist and whether he was better than Keith Richards.
Tara M Taylor Jul 17, 2017
Keith Richards is a consummate guitar player. As someone who’s studied guitar for a good portion of her 63 years, Richards’ playing still amazes me. His grasp of rhythm blues guitar is excellent and his timing superb. He’s the backbone of most Rolling Stones songs. I don’t know if you’re familiar with open G tuning, but Richards uses it a lot and on staples like Brown Sugar, Honky Tonk Women, etc. Open tuning tends to be easier to play than standard tuning since playing all open strings produces a chord (G in the case of open G). Richards takes simple open G chords and crafts them into instantly recognizable Stones’ hits. This is no fluke, rather based on a solid understanding of blues chord progressions, what sounds good and will “hook” the listener. Though they have distinctly different styles, I’d put Lennon on equal par with Richards.Jeff Johnston Nov 21, 2018
John Lennon’s rhythm guitar playing was underrated for certain. And also on many of the covers, where his rhythm guitar drives the whole band. Notably the Larry Williams and Carl Perkins numbers.
As far as the Stones, early on Jones and Richards functioned much like John and George, trading off lead and rhythm lead. But generally in both bands, John and Brian Jones would play the opening riff (I Feel Fine, The Last Time) while Keith and George would play lead. There are notable exceptions, of course: Day Tripper, Satisfaction among them.
Forrest Evans
Sep 9, 2018
Many different styles and there is a synergy in the Rolling Stones that works. They are doing their thing, the Beatles did their thing, yes there are better players technically but until you write songs as good as the Stones wrote, and play together as well as they play, then don’t pretend to sit on your couch and be an expert. Relax, you can listen to someone else if you want.Joe Becker, works at NoWayOut Films
They were both creative and both developed styles of their own.
John played complex chords and did some really awesome things with triplets and whatnot. It is a very unique style and he was very good. He liked to play sloppy and rough, but not always. He liked the garage band sound. His rhythm always fit the song, and his timing was good.Keith does not just play rhythm. He plays a mix of rhythm and lead. He develops very memorable hooks. He’s very unique and his playing is riveting, mesmerizing at times. infectious.
John Lennon’s playing was made to blend with the song, while Keith’s is the song.
Pick up a guitar and try to play their stuff. If you play the chords the way John played them, it can get quite tricky. Complex chords, tricky rhythms, and they always fit the song. Then try doing what Keith does. Both were very good, and both were innovative. But Keith’s stands out a lot more because again, John Lennon’s playing was made to blend with the song, while Keith’s is the song.
Carl Garthwaite, Guitarist since 1970, Electronic Technician since 1976.
Speaking strictly about playing, perhaps John Lennon knew a few more “jazz” and orchestral chords, as well as intricate melodic structures with unusual key changes, but as others have mentioned, any decent guitarist could have played his parts, and no one would have been the wiser. I’d consider him more of a writer and singer than a guitarist.
On the other hand, Keith Richards’ playing is always 100% recognizable as his alone. Keith’s playing invariably drives the Stones’ sound. Without Keith, the Stones would just be another average band with a great singer. Also, it’s not at all accurate to consider Keith solely a “rhythm guitarist”. He’s a Guitarist! A full range guitarist who inventively and intuitively mixes rhythms with riffs and bits of lead playing. Sure he’s not a virtuoso lead playing shredder, but if you had a band with only one guitarist, Keith’s playing would always keep your interest and fill all the musical niches required to be great.Dave Anthony
Dave Anthony, worked at Bon Appetite Answered Jul 12, 2017.
Originally Answered: Why isn’t John Lennon more widely known for his guitar playing? He was a much better rhythm player than Keith Richards. There’s an old story about Keith Richards I really like. A musician was sitting in with the stones once, the band started playing and the guy said the groove feel kind of funny so when they stopped he said something like “hey, you know doesn’t the guitar follow the bass and the bass follow the drums?” Which was met by “not in this band, everyone just follows Keef.” I think that might be why Mr. Richards is so known for his guitar playing. I think of Lennon more as a great songwriter than a great guitarist, as far as guitar playing is concerned during that era, Jimi Hendrix simply eclipses everyone else. -
Emmylou Harris -“I’ll Be Your Baby Tonight”
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The video opens but unfortunately won’t play properly. However, a couple of glimpses where it has briefly worked have been enough to tell me she has a lovely sweet voice. I’ll try again another day and hope it is working better for me. Too frustrating trying to watch for just a few seconds at a time. I don’t know who chose the song, but it is one of my favourites and the perfect choice for young Luli IMHO.
By the way, it’s okay to be biassed when it comes to favourite nieces. One of mine is currently at Bologna University in Italy, continuing her postgraduate studies there for six months. She seems to be having such a wonderful time that I suggested to her parents that she may not want to come home. Bologna is the oldest university in the world, as well as one of the leading academic institutions in Italy and Europe. It is one of the most prestigious Italian universities, commonly ranking in the first places of national rankings. My niece was already a multilinguist and no doubt her Italian is going to improve immensely mixing with Italians. Reminds me of Mona and Lisa spending six months in Adelaide to improve their English.
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Hi Mike and Jung. Yes, “A Day in the Life” and “Yesterday” would have to be at or near the top for most of us. So would George’s “Something”, and “Here Comes the Sun”, although I’d probably have his “While My Guitar Gently Weeps” higher. However, there are probably several other Beatles’ songs I’d have above George’s two, but this can of course change from day to day and mood to mood for me!
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Well done once again Jacki. Do you know there are many composers out there just looking for the right poet/lyricist to connect with, just as there are many poets/lyricists out there looking for the right music composer. Have you thought about trying to connect with one?
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That was a well researched and very interesting piece from you Jung. Thanks for sharing it with us. As you highlight, we owe so much to those in our society who are creators when there are so many powerful people who are destructive. Artists like the MLT contribute much positive value to this world and take back very little in comparison and we are so fortunate that they allow us to share in their beautiful, colourful vision.
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You have a very wise sister Tomás!
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Did John Lennon and Paul McCartney meet after the breakup of The Beatles?
Yes, they did. And there’s a good story about that, too.
On April 24, 1976, John Lennon and Paul McCartney were in New York at Lennon’s apartment and they were just bumming around watching Saturday Night Live on TV. Lorne Michaels came on the screen and said he would offer the Beatles $3,000 to reunite on SNL at some point and just play three songs.
Unbeknownst to Michaels, Lennon and McCartney were watching the show. As they sat there watching TV, Lennon and McCartney briefly considered grabbing their equipment and heading to the SNL studio nearby and crashing the set with an impromptu show. But they abandoned the idea almost as soon as they had thought of it.
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I think you are correct Tomas. However, I don’t mean to be that prickly but can understand that I may sometimes come across that way. Like everybody else here, I love the MonaLisa Twins, their music, their inspirations, and their vision. I’m also aware that we all have our personal preferences and individual passions too. For some of us, it veers towards the more bubblegum pop of the sixties while others it is the more hard rock sound of the sixties. The yin and yang, the light and dark, the sweet and sour, the Epstein and Oldham, the Beatles and the Stones.
There is currently thought that “Practically all the songs on the radio now are bubblegum pop. Just because they “technically” call a song “hip hop” or “rock” or “R&B” doesn’t make it that. I think it should be acknowledged that bubblegum is definitely back now, not just ‘trying to come back’”
I value the beautiful diversity and differences that manage to emerge from what at times seems like a totally crazy world and appreciate that the Wagner family have created this wonderful Club that allows us to come together in a comfortable, respectful way to share our various passions.
One of my passions is how and why people create music and what internal, external and establishment forces impact on the final product. In this regard we are fortunate that Papa Rudi has managed to create the perfect environment for his adorable twin daughters to apply their creative abilities in such a perfect, unadulterated way, to produce the gems we constantly receive from them. My hat goes off to him! Along with the amazing ‘mumager’ Michaela, they are the perfect team and what I consider to be the perfect role models for what a healthy family can be. More power to the MLT I say!
For me, my views and preferences are of no more importance or value than anyone else here. Sometimes I do like to play the Devil’s advocate. After all, who is the ‘evil’ twin, Mona or Lisa!
Thank you for understanding and please everyone, don’t be offended by my sometimes very passionate music analysis. In the end, I think we all appreciate the same thing, the final product, while people like me sometimes like to analyse how that product got there!
I will continue to consider The Beatles, The Rolling Stones, and The Beach Boys in the same way and everyone, of course, is free to engage or ignore. As they say, You can be Beethoven, I’ll be Mozart and Schwartznegger will be Bach!
By the way Tomas, I was serious about that yearly single challenge between the Beatles and the Rolling Stones, after all, it could be interesting to see what Beatles fans and Rolling Stones fans were listening to each year of the sixties, commencing in 1964 and ending in 1970!
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Wow! That is a huge difference. You have one very lucky niece. I hope she appreciates the consideration.
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Nice one David. They harmonise so well. An excellent video! How come Marie looks so much younger than them?
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The Ivy League – “Running Around In Circles”
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The Ivy League – “A Girl Like You”
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Hi Jung. Please don’t stress too much. You don’t need to get your head around my particular musical preferences. When you were a teenager, I guess you were listening mainly to the Beach Boys and the Beatles. For me, it was the Rolling Stones, the Kinks, the Animals, the Who and Manfred Mann. Then what I consider to be lesser groups like the Troggs and the Dave Clarke Five. It wasn’t until all the hysteria had died down that I started appreciating the Beatles more. As the Seventies progressed, I also started listening more to the back catalogues of groups like The Hollies, The Byrds, The Loving Spoonful and many, many more groups. This was basically because I had been Rolling Stoned out! We were so fortunate in the Seventies to have so many groups and solo acts and so much great music being produced.
However, like everyone else I know, I kept coming back to the music of my youth, and for me, that was mainly, but not only the Rolling Stones. Of course, I also had some great Stones 70s albums to appreciate. In particular, Their albums (with guitarist Mick Taylor), “Sticky Fingers”, “Exile On Main Street” and “Goats Head Soup”!
“I think your assertion here Howard is inaccurate and overstates Tony Asher’s involvement in the album.”
I am well aware of Brian’s and Tony’s relative contributions to the “Pet Sounds” album Jung. My claim is that it wasn’t really a Beach Boys recording. It would be fairer to call it a Brian Wilson’s Beach Boys album, as it would have been for most of their albums. The Beach Boys had the luxury of Brian retiring from touring for eighteen months to write and record. He took the opportunity to do what he had always wanted to do and chose a collaborator from outside the Beach Boys. He also chose professional musicians for the recording. He had argued with earlier albums that studio musicians were more efficient, got the job done quicker, and cost much less than using his own band. The rest of the Beach Boys merely added their vocals to the finished product. They mostly didn’t even like the album, Dennis Wilson and Mike Love in particular.
By the way, I have never questioned the quality of Brian Wilson’s “Pet Sounds” album. My argument is that when you are listening to any Beatles or Stones albums of the time, you basically know who you are listening to. With the Beach Boys, apart from the vocals, no one really knows.
More on this subject later. There is too much for one post.
